NC 2009 SSc5.2: Site Development—Maximize Open Space

  • Schools_SSc5-2_Type1_Open Space Diagram
  • Why open space?

    This credit is intended to promote sites with large areas of vegetated open space that promote biodiversity and recreation—which can also add an amenity to your project, help with natural stormwater management, and mitigate the urban heat islandA densely populated area in which pavement and buildings absorb, store, and release solar energy, making the vicinity warmer than it would be if the pavement and buildings were not present. effect.

    Difficulty varies by location

    It’s generally quite easy for rural and suburban projects to meet the requirements of this credit—this is especially true for schools, particularly those that have sports fields...

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87 Comments

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Elliot Powers Director of Asia Business Development
Jan 31 2012
Member
111 Thumbs Up

SSc5.2: Case 1 or Case 3?

Greetings from Taiwan! Our project is located in a science park that does have requirements for "open space" and "green space," which would indicate that we employ Case 1 to achieve this credit. Problem is, the local requirements for those areas are not consistent with LEED. For example, the locals generally define "Open Space" as anything outside the building footprintBuilding footprint is the area on a project site used by the building structure, defined by the perimeter of the building plan. Parking lots, parking garages, landscapes, and other nonbuilding facilities are not included in the building footprint., while "Green Space" as any vegetated area on the site. Obviously using the 125% of local open space requirements calculation wouldn't make sense, as the intent of this credit greatly differs from how the locals' define it.

So, despite the existence of local "zoning" with open space requirements, my inclination is to go with Case 3, where there is local zoning but with no open space requirement. Is this sound reasoning, or can anyone fashion a better way to approach this?

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Ramón Gutiérrez Building Engineer IDOM
Dec 19 2011
Guest
9 Thumbs Up

Open space below the building

Hello from Spain,
Our ground floor is smaller than our building footprintBuilding footprint is the area on a project site used by the building structure, defined by the perimeter of the building plan. Parking lots, parking garages, landscapes, and other nonbuilding facilities are not included in the building footprint.. So we have vegetated open spaces at ground level, outside of our ground floor and below the building.
Two questions:
Can these open spaces count for SSc5.2 calculations?
Can these open spaces with native or adaptative vegetation count for SSc5.1 calculations?
Thanks!

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Omer Moltay
Dec 07 2011
Member
893 Thumbs Up

Playfields?

(1) Would hardscape playfields such as basketball court count towards the pedestrian oriented hardscape?

(2) What about turf surface soccer field? I guess this would a vegetated open space without doubts?

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Dec 18 2011 Moderator

Omer, LEED Interpretation #5669 states "...installing playing fields can count towards achievement of SSc5.2 for open space, but does not achieve the intent of SSc5.1 for restored habitat."

However, other Interpretations note that the fields should not be artificial turf. I would say that this latter piece excludes the basketball courts but not a grass pitch.

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 19 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Omer,
One review I got when attempting SSc5.1 with turf grass, it shouldn't be monoculture and does not require mowing. If it's a real, live grass, then it must grow. I guess the credit deals with shrubs & bushes in most part.

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Elliot Powers Director of Asia Business Development
Oct 27 2011
Member
111 Thumbs Up

Open Space Requirement

Count me in with those frustrated with this credit language/ requirements. So I can be confident of our calcs, the local requirements call for vegetated open space to equal 25% of the total developed site area. LEED requires the project to exceed that local requirement by 25% (.25 x .25 = .3125). Therefore, if our site contains 10,000 sf, we achieve this credit by the site containing 3,125 sf of vegetated open space. Correct?

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Emily Catacchio Sustainability Specialist, Wight and Company Oct 28 2011 Moderator

Hi Elliot,

If you take a look under Checklists, Design Development, there is a chart explaining the various calculations for each compliance path. I'm not sure which path your project falls under, so I'm not sure if your math is correct. 

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 07 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Not all green fields can count as such. I had a library project within a park setting. No doubt that all those green should count but instead the reviewer asked, "Are those greens not monoculture and does not require regular maintenance?". Of course they must be monoculture (of the same grass kind) and of course they require maintenance (they are not synthetic). So, I ended up dropping the point. When in doubt, just submit it-you are not charged by the credit but by the project size. Let the Reviewer ask you a clarification, then you will get wiser in the end.

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Kathleen Burke Gastinger Walker Harden Architects
Sep 21 2011
Member
29 Thumbs Up

zoning requirement SSc5.2

Our project is located in a small, tight suburban lot. The only landscape requirements within the zoning information is that A) 5% of the parking lot must be landscaped, B) any retention areas must be landscaped (not within our site boundary) and C) the landscape setbacks must be landscaped (also not within our site boundary.) Basically our landscaped area = 20% of our parking lot paved area. We think this meets the requirement for SSc5.2, BUT are worried that LEED will make us use the 20% of the site area. Which we do not meet - we are currently landscaped 12% of our site area. But if we follow our 5% zoning number we are eligible for the credit and also eligible for the exemplary performanceIn LEED, certain credits have established thresholds beyond basic credit achievement. Meeting these thresholds can earn additional points through Innovation in Design (ID) or Innovation in Operations (IO) points. As a general rule of thumb, ID credits for exemplary performance are awarded for doubling the credit requirements and/or achieving the next incremental percentage threshold. However, this rule varies on a case by case basis, so check the credit requirements.. Any advice here?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Oct 21 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Kathleen, I think LEED would require 20% of your site area to be open space. Does the project achieve SSc2? Remember you can also use pedestrian hardscape as part of the open space as long as at least 25% of that open area is vegetated.

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 07 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Kathleen, write a narrative explaining your case and have it titled "Read this first." As always, it catches the attention on the Reviewer before jumping into any conclusion and bringing up requirements. If you think you satisfy the zoning requirements, provide the Reviewer a link to a website were he/she can verify your claim. If no website, provided zoning code section. Or, if non is available at that time, submit it anyway and let it be reviewed. Then you'll know what to provide.

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Valentin Grimaud Thermal Engineer TERAO Green Building Engineering
Aug 03 2011
Member
154 Thumbs Up

Ground depth beneath vegetated area

Hi everyone!

I have a very specific question regarding vegetated area. Should the earth depth under the vegetated area be of a minimum thickness in order to be considered as vegetated area?
The project we are working on is located in a very dense area (thus earning SS credit 2), so that the whole area is built on a big concrete slab; vegetated areas are thus also built on concrete, and not directly linked to the natural ground. Should I look to the local definition of vegetated area? What are the restrictions for LEED, I did not find anything about it?

Thanks!

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Valentin Grimaud Thermal Engineer, TERAO Green Building Engineering Sep 30 2011 Member 154 Thumbs Up

Nobody has any idea on this specific question?
I understand that this credit address biodiversity issues, not imperviousnessResistance to penetration by a liquid and is calculated as the percentage of area covered by a paving system that does not allow moisture to soak into the ground. or stormwater management, but, still, I was wondering about this aspect.
Thanks again.

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Susan Walter Sr Project Architect, Wilmot/Sanz Oct 20 2011 Guest 1454 Thumbs Up

I think you have a unique case and that it will require you to carefully narrate the vegetate areas for submittal. Projects have earned this credit through vegetated roof systems that have little 'earth' depth but not all projects. Research those exeptions, write your narrative and let us know how it goes. Your vegetation should help with stormwater and with reducing heat islands. I would build my case starting there.

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Oct 21 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Valentin, I agree with Susan's suggestion. The definition for vegetation in this credit is not explicit, but if you keep in mind the intent of the credit (biodiversity and recreation) when proposing your approach, and ensure that the vegetated and open space areas provided in your project meet the required % threshold, you may have a case.

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Catalina A SUSTAINABLE DESIGN CONSULTANT
Jul 29 2011
Member
127 Thumbs Up

Roof Terraces and Balconies

We are certifying a Hotel Project earning credit SSc2. The Hotel has two open space restaurants located in the first floor and two terraces with vegetation and a pool accessible to everyone in the roof, also each room of the Hotel has a Balcony with vegetation.

Can roof terraces count for open space SSc5.2 calculations? Only part of the roof terraces is green roof.
Two: Can the vegetation in the balconies of each room count as green roof?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Oct 21 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Catalina, Because you are earning SSc2, I would think you can count the entire roof terrace area as the reference guide states examples of urban open space include "pocket parks, accessible roof decks, plazas and courtyards."

What type of vegetation is on the balconies? I would think unless it is an actual green roof, it cannot be considered as such.

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JOHN COOK Campus Sustainability Coordinator University of California Riverside
Jul 15 2011
Member
86 Thumbs Up

Tennis Court use for meeting SSc5.2 Maximize Open Space

Can we count count our Tennis courts - that are part of the project boundary towards our Space requirement in Case 2? The courts are hardscaped.

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David Posada Sustainability Manager, GBD Architects Jul 15 2011 Guest Expert 4554 Thumbs Up

It's hard to say for sure if a reviewer would accept a tennis court as "pedestrian oriented hardscape" since those are typically plazas, but it's worth a try. This assumes you're earning SSc2, Development Density, to allow including hardscaped areas.

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 19 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Did you build it with the building? I guess, that would count for SSc5.2 and remain as a tennis court for the life of the building.

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Robert Mulcahy Building Scientist Pure Air Control Services
Jul 11 2011
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28 Thumbs Up

Establishing the LEED Project Boundary

I’m trying to confirm the LEED Project Boundary. Normally, the LEED Project Boundary for a single building development would be the same as the site boundary. However, the construction of our classroom building is going to allow us to eliminate 17 portables and create a huge open green space in front of the new building. So my thinking is since we are pursuing the Maximize Open Space I will need to include the space where the portables currently exist as part of the LEED Project Boundary. Is that correct?

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Susan Walter Sr Project Architect, Wilmot/Sanz Jul 11 2011 Guest 1454 Thumbs Up

I would think that if you are removing 17 portables and relandscaping that area as part of your project that this area is also part of the site boundary. Read the campus guide and don't gerrymander the boundary.

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 19 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Property lines & project boundaries do not coincide sometimes. What I normally submit to LEED is the limit of work. If you are doing work here and there, explain in a narrative the scope and limit of your work. It's not always a good thing to have a bigger area. Consistency is one key when showing to the Reviewer your real intent.

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J Douglas Dietrich
Jul 01 2011
Member
120 Thumbs Up

Ground-Mounted Solar PV Arrays

If there is an open space with (1) a ground-mounted solar PV array and (2) native plantings or adapted vegetationAdapted (or introduced) plants reliably grow well in a given habitat with minimal winter protection, pest control, fertilization, or irrigation once their root systems are established. Adapted plants are considered low maintenance and not invasive. beneath the PV panels and around them so as not to block sunlight, would the area beneath the PV panels be able to contribute to the SS c1 Habitat square footage calc, the SS c2 Open Space calc, both calcs, or neither calc?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Oct 21 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

I would think this area could count for both SSc5.1 and SSc5.2 but may be worth checking with GBCI or submitting a LEED Interpretation Request.

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Julian Bott Principal Design Consultant Cundall Hong Kong
Jun 08 2011
Member
374 Thumbs Up

zoning requirement split 30% and 95%

Hi we have a site whereby our LEED boundary includes two separately zoned areas and one is zoned for buildings with 30% open space required by local planners. The second space equivalent to the same area again (i.e half our site) has a requirement to achieve 95% in order to keep it open as a park.

We have to include the park within our boundary as our building has a carpark below it.

To go for 25% extra space on top of the 95% is just a bit too much to force onto the rest of the site.

Does anyone think we have a case to say that provied we go for extra 25% in the built area the parkland should be exempt from the calculation as it already meets the intent of the credit.

Hope I haven't confused you all too much

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Susan Walter Sr Project Architect, Wilmot/Sanz Jul 11 2011 Guest 1454 Thumbs Up

Are you building this park along with the carpark underneath or is it an existing condition? Would your project earn the credit, hypothetically, under the other options? Would you meet the 50% EP threshold combining both sites together? I think if you can look at your site more holistically you may be able to build your case for Option 1 with the reviewers. It is hard to understand based on the information you provided.

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Oct 24 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Hi Julian, Any updates on your approach here? Although there is not an explicit approach for this situation, it seems best to evaluate each area separately and meet the credit requirements using the appropriate compliance path for each individual area.

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Daniel Hartsig Sustainability Analyst Transwestern
Jun 03 2011
Member
11 Thumbs Up

Code defines Maximum Open Space

Hello Everyone-

I'm currently working on a project where the local code defines no minimum amount of open space. Instead, they define a maximum amount of open space (at 19% of site area).
So... the site has a zoning requirement but it's a maximum, not minimum, so we can't use either option 1 or 2. We're trying to determine if we can submit as alternate compliance or if we should submit as option 3 (existing ordinance but no open space requirement). Any thoughts?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Nov 09 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

I would think submitting as option 3 would be the best option, however this requires 20% of the project's site area which exceeds the maximum amount allowed by zoning for your project (19%). Would your project be able to get an allowance to achieve 20% of the site area as open space? If not, it sounds like the credit may not be achievable for the project, however I suggest submitting an inquiry to GBCI to confirm.

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Elliot Powers Director of Asia Business Development Nov 09 2011 Member 111 Thumbs Up

Hi Daniel:
Perhaps you've already thought of this, but maybe you can approach the local authorities and seek a variance that allows you that additional 1%, particularly when you present what should be a palatable reason. Don't know the size of the site, but the additional 1% may not represent a whole lot of space. Just a thought. Good luck.

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Rosana Correa Director Casa do Futuro
May 09 2011
Member
28 Thumbs Up

Reflecting Pool

Hello everyone!

Will areas covered with reflecting pools count as open space areas?

Thanks!

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Susan Walter Sr Project Architect, Wilmot/Sanz May 18 2011 Guest 1454 Thumbs Up

See Reference Guide under All Cases: Only wetlands or naturally designed ponds may count as open space and the side slope gradients avreage 1:4 or less and are vegetated. Seems like reflecting pools do not count as they don't provide biodiversity to the site.

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Felipe Duran Dec 15 2011 Member 45 Thumbs Up

Susan,
and what about swimming pools? I do get that it won’t count as a “natural pond”, but it definitely should count as pedestrian oriented area, I read above in birds´eye view part: “promote biodiversity and recreation” and: “vegetated open space, plazas, picnic areas, or outdoor recreational activities” As far as I understand - a swimming pool is recreation area and it definitely is an area for outdoor recreational activity, or how should I interpret this?
--

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Susan Walter Sr Project Architect, Wilmot/Sanz Dec 15 2011 Guest 1454 Thumbs Up

I don't think a swimming pool would qualify. The 'recreation' language is consistently tied to land type of uses. The pool would not contribute to biodiversity plus it contains and uses harsh chemicals. It also doesn't do anything for stormwater management or reducing the heat island effectHeat island effect refers to the absorption of heat by hardscapes, such as dark, nonreflective pavement and buildings, and its radiation to surrounding areas. Particularly in urban areas, other sources may include vehicle exhaust, air-conditioners, and street equipment; reduced airflow from tall buildings and narrow streets exacerbates the effect. which are also listed. The credit talks about water only in the sense of ponds and wetlands.

If you are achieving SSc2 you maybe able to count the surrounding concrete as 'pedestrian oriented landscape'. Anyone else have any thoughts?

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 15 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

My rule for all our LEED Projects, "When in doubt, let the reviewer decide." Since everything is paid for upfront, I might as well pick the Reviewer's mind. Most of the time, I don't get the credit. The take away is, I get a step wiser. About pools, it's not a pedestrian oriented; people don't walk on them and certainly (not) contributing to heat island effectHeat island effect refers to the absorption of heat by hardscapes, such as dark, nonreflective pavement and buildings, and its radiation to surrounding areas. Particularly in urban areas, other sources may include vehicle exhaust, air-conditioners, and street equipment; reduced airflow from tall buildings and narrow streets exacerbates the effect.. Unless you will treat the water and recycle it for your landscape use, WEc1 is out. In case of SSc5.2, Maximize open space, it has to be vegetated.

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Jeff Marshall The EcoLogic Studio
Apr 13 2011
Member
185 Thumbs Up

Artificial Turf

For a mixed-use project (1st story commercial, top 7 multi-family residential), in an urban setting (achieves Community Connectivity SSc2): can artificial turf on the roof deck contribute to achievement of SSc5.2? The project is nearly zero-lot line, and reference manual says we can include pedestrian oriented hardscape as open space (due to SSc2), can the artificial turf be counted? If so, would it be eligible as part of the vegetated area (required to be 25% of open space), or considered as pedestrian-oriented hardscape?

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Apr 14 2011 Moderator

Jeff, I think you could count the artificial turf as part of the hardscape, but it's hard for me to imagine how it could be counted as part of the vegetated portion.

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Ellen Mitchell Sustainable Design Coordinator HKS, Inc.
Apr 11 2011
Member
215 Thumbs Up

Definition of Site Area?

This may be a dumb question, but I have a project that falls under Case 3 - provide vegetated open space equal to 20% of the project's site area. I can't find any credit language that says whether the site area includes the building footprintBuilding footprint is the area on a project site used by the building structure, defined by the perimeter of the building plan. Parking lots, parking garages, landscapes, and other nonbuilding facilities are not included in the building footprint. or not. Other open space requirements in both SS5.1 and other options of SS5.2 are pretty clear about whether to include or exclude the building footprint, but this option doesn't seem to have a clear distinction. My project is on a very tight urban site that is primarily made up of pedestrian hardscape/ vegetation, but it comes nowhere close to 20% of the overall site if the footprint is included. Am I missing something?

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Nicole Michel Apr 11 2011 Guest 30 Thumbs Up

Hi Ellen,
I believe the definition of site area does include the building footprintBuilding footprint is the area on a project site used by the building structure, defined by the perimeter of the building plan. Parking lots, parking garages, landscapes, and other nonbuilding facilities are not included in the building footprint.. In the glossary at the back of the Reference Guide, the definition of site area is: synonymous with property area. Under property area: is the total area within the legal property boundaries of a site; it encompasses all areas of the site, including constructed and non-constructed areas.

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 15 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Hi Ellen,
Site Area would mean something that you are developing under your limit of work. Say, if you are to build a multi-purpose building in a park setting, you cannot claim the whole park as your site. You draw a limit of work area you need to accomplish your task. Remember, the 'dumbest question' is a 'question' you never asked.

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Lauren Glasscock Sr. Sustainability Professional KEMA Services, Inc.
Mar 21 2011
Guest Expert
3456 Thumbs Up

Permeable Paving - "vegetated open space"

If our permeable paving has grass growing through it could that count as both hardscape for SSc7.1 and for vegetated open space in SSc5.2? We aren't achieving SSc2 so we cannot technically include hardscape in our SSc5.2 calculations.

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Mar 21 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Lauren,
This is a good question and I haven't come across it on a project to date. I would think you may have a case to use it to meet both credit requirements, but best to submit a CIRCredit Interpretation Ruling. Used by design team members experiencing difficulties in the application of a LEED prerequisite or credit to a project. Typically, difficulties arise when specific issues are not directly addressed by LEED information/guide or LEED interpretation to GBCI to determine for sure.

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David Posada Sustainability Manager, GBD Architects Mar 25 2011 Guest Expert 4554 Thumbs Up

This sounds reasonable if the permeable paving is an open grid system that is more soil than grid, especially if you "discount" the area of vegetated area, since it won't exactly be a lush garden. If it was a 1000 sf open grid area that was, say, 75% open, maybe you count only 500 or 750 sf of vegetated area?

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Tiombe Parrish Sustainable Design Coordinator, Jacobs GBNA May 18 2011 Member 42 Thumbs Up

Lauren,
I have the exact same question on a current project. We are no where near CIRCredit Interpretation Ruling. Used by design team members experiencing difficulties in the application of a LEED prerequisite or credit to a project. Typically, difficulties arise when specific issues are not directly addressed by LEED information/guide time. I'm very curious as to the answer you get. Please post.

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Lauren Glasscock Sr. Sustainability Professional, KEMA Services, Inc. May 24 2011 Guest Expert 3456 Thumbs Up

Hi Tiombe,

Wish I could tell you that I had an answer but I don't yet. We haven't submitted a CIRCredit Interpretation Ruling. Used by design team members experiencing difficulties in the application of a LEED prerequisite or credit to a project. Typically, difficulties arise when specific issues are not directly addressed by LEED information/guide. If anyone else has clarity on the matter and/or has submitted a CIR, I'd love their thoughts as well.

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Romano Iglesia LEED-BIM Facilitator, Carde Ten Architects Dec 15 2011 Guest 67 Thumbs Up

Lauren,
I think you can double dip on Ssc7.1 & Ssc5.2. Here's one thing though, SSc7.1 has to be 50% pervious and the remaining 50% has to be at least SRIThe solar reflectance index (SRI) is a measure of a material's ability to reject solar heat, as shown by a small temperature rise. Standard black (reflectance 0.05, emittance 0.90) is 0 and standard white (reflectance 0.80, emittance 0.90) is 100. For example, a standard black surface has a temperature rise of 90_F (50_C) in full sun, and a standard white surface has a temperature rise of 14.6_F (8.1_C). Once the maximum temperature rise of a given material has been computed, the SRI can be calculated by interpolating between the values for white and black. Materials with the highest SRI values are the coolest choices for paving. Because of the way SRI is defined, particularly hot materials can even take slightly negative values, and particularly cool materials can even exceed 100. 29. If you are able to quantify, you can include it. For SSc5.2, it has to be 25% (of total open spaces) vegetated and pedestrian oriented.

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Valentin Grimaud Thermal Engineer TERAO Green Building Engineering
Feb 25 2011
Member
154 Thumbs Up

Case 3 with Development density and Community Connectivity

Hello everyone!

I am pretty new at LEED, and I am working on a building in urban areas that will earn SS credit 2. Credit Requirements specifies that "pedestrian-oriented hardscape areas can contribute to credit compliance. For such projects, a minimum of 25% of the open space counted must be vegetated." while LEEDUser Bird's eye view states that "25% of the required open space must be vegetated". It's not exactly the same thing for me. For example, let's say that I have a site area of 5 000 m2. I need to provide 20% of open space, so 1 000 m2. If the building site actually provide 2 000 m2 of open space, what is the actual area of vegetated space required? Is it 25% of the required 1 000 m2 or 25% or the counted 2 000 m2? It's not very clear for me, so thanks for your help!

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Feb 25 2011 Moderator

Valentin, you bring up a good point, and I am going to edit LEEDuser's language accordingly. I think from the LEED Reference Guide (pages 85 and 87) it is clear that the 25% should be counted against the total open space (2,000 m2), not just the minimum required.

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Valentin Grimaud Thermal Engineer, TERAO Green Building Engineering Feb 25 2011 Member 154 Thumbs Up

Thanks Tristan for your quick answer.
Just a further clarification, using the same example as above. I'm not sure if I am properly doing my calculation. I have 2 000 m2 of hardscape plus a garden roof. Do I need to add the surface of the garden roof to the surface of the hardscape, and then calculate if 25% of the total is actually vegetated, or do I need to check if the surface of the garden roof is equal to 25% of the surface of the hardscape?

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Feb 25 2011 Moderator

I think the first method is correct—take the total open space being claimed, and multiply by 0.25.

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Valentin Grimaud Thermal Engineer, TERAO Green Building Engineering Feb 27 2011 Member 154 Thumbs Up

Tristan, what do you think of this interpretation of the vegetated space requirement: in case of SSc2, you can take into account hardscape, but in order to do this, the hardscape must be at least 25% vegetated. I think it's more consistent with the idea of the credit, which intent to reintroduce nature into urban area. In this idea, it's not the sum of hardscape + vegetated roof that need to have a 25:75 ration of vegetated area, but only the hardscape, and the vegetated roof come as a plus. What do you think of this interpretation?

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Feb 27 2011 Moderator

Valentin, I think what you are describing is a more stringent path than the one required by LEED. If you want to interpret it that way, I would encourage it, but I wouldn't consider it necessary.

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Mike Phelps LEED AP CYNTERGY AEC
Feb 15 2011
Member
32 Thumbs Up

Case 2 of SSc5.2

The language for this case specifies open vegetated space "adjacent" to the building. Does adjacent mean next to the building or can it be vegetated open space near to the building as well? Also if it can be near, how near? Is anywhere within the contiguous project boundary acceptable as adjacent open space? Thank-you.

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Feb 23 2011 Moderator

Stephanie, I don't think there is a specific definition of "adjacent." I would say that it probably just needs to be within the LEED boundary. Is there a specific situation you're trying to evaluate?

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Rebecca Owens Sustainability Planner / LEED AP BD+C
Jan 18 2011
Guest
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1:4 slope ratio

1. In the credit language "Wetlands or naturally designed ponds may count as open space AND the side slope gradients average 1:4 (vertical: horizontal) or less and are vegetated"--is the AND supposed to say "IF"? I think this is a type-o.
2. If the slope is greater than 1:4, can you count the wetland, water body etc. area below the slope, and exclude the slope area--or do you have to exclude both the slope and area that it contains (wetland etc.) from the calculation?

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Jan 20 2011 Moderator

Yes, I think that's a typo. I think the intention of the language is specifically to exclude both the slope area and the wetland, due to inaccessibility of both.

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Norma Rosowski Sustainability Consultant The Beck Group
Jan 04 2011
Member
614 Thumbs Up

Include City Street?

we have a project that a city street intersects, we want to claim the small greenspace on the other side of the city street that is part of the project and is owned by the project owner. do we need to include the city street in our LEED boundary and calculations?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Jan 11 2011 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Norma,
There is some guidance in the LEED 2009 MPR Supplemental Guidance doc released in November 2009 that suggests you may not have to include the city street area in your boundary (nor in the calculations) as long as you can confirm particular conditions are met. See page 13 and 14 that explain when you do not have to have a contiguous boundary (p.13: "Including non-contiguous parcels in the LEED project boundary" and p.14 "easements and leases").
Here is a link to the MPR: http://www.usgbc.org/ShowFile.aspx?DocumentID=6473

Also, remember that whatever site boundary is chosen, it needs to be consistent across all credits and must include the entire scope of the project.

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Laurie Hammack
Dec 01 2010
Member
103 Thumbs Up

Location of hardscape areas

In reading the wording for this credit under 2009 NC, it mentions for all cases that "projects in urban areas that earn SS Credit 2: Development Density and Community Connectivity, pedestrian-oriented hardscape areas can contribute to credit compliance. For such projects, a minimum of 25% of the open space counted must be vegetated." My question is do these hardscape and vegetated areas have to be located on the project site, or could you count adjacent pedestrial plazas and parks that are not part of the LEED project boundry--but that are within the Community Connectivity 1/2 mile radius boundry?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Dec 01 2010 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Laurie,
The pedestrian-oriented hardscape areas have to be within your LEED project boundary to contribute to meeting the credit requirements.

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Pablo Fortunato Suarez Principal ESD Consultant/Architect GreenArc Sustainable Building & Architecture
Nov 29 2010
Member
1328 Thumbs Up

green walls/vertical greenery

My questions for green walls/vertical greenery:
1) Would "green walls*" or "vertical greenery*" qualify for credit point under this category?
2) If so how would computations be for coverage area?
3) If not would this qualify for Innovation credit?

*green walls or vertical greenery - refer to plants (creepers or crawlers) growing on walls using various methods from as simple as letting vines grow on mesh or lines, to racks that contain planting medium; these are used as part of wall treatment in facades.

- also posted in related credit at EBOMEBOM is an acronym for Existing Buildings: Operations & Maintenance, one of the LEED 2009 rating sytems.

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Nov 29 2010 Moderator

I don't think they would qualify in terms of how this credit is typically calculated.

I would say you'd have to make an argument for including them, and it would be up to the reviewer to accept it or not. A CIRCredit Interpretation Ruling. Used by design team members experiencing difficulties in the application of a LEED prerequisite or credit to a project. Typically, difficulties arise when specific issues are not directly addressed by LEED information/guide may be needed to know whether this will work.

What's your argument? Let us know how it goes.

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Lauren Glasscock Sr. Sustainability Professional, KEMA Services, Inc. Jun 16 2011 Guest Expert 3456 Thumbs Up

Hi Pablo and Tristan,

Any new information on this approach? We wanted to try it too for our tight urban project site.

Roof areas count for urban areas so why not the visual surfaces of vines growing up the side of a building as part of a green screen?

Has anyone else submitted a CIRCredit Interpretation Ruling. Used by design team members experiencing difficulties in the application of a LEED prerequisite or credit to a project. Typically, difficulties arise when specific issues are not directly addressed by LEED information/guide?

Thanks!
Lauren

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Lauren Glasscock Sr. Sustainability Professional KEMA Services, Inc.
Nov 08 2010
Guest Expert
3456 Thumbs Up

Requirement for landscape but not open space

Hello,

My project has a requirement for landscaping as the city requires that at least 20% of the site is landscaped. Should we state that we fall under Case 1 even though there isn't exactly an open space requirement?

thanks,
Lauren

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Nov 09 2010 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Yes, Case 1 would be most appropriate for your project.

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Laurie Hammack
Oct 21 2010
Member
103 Thumbs Up

Dedicated Open Space separate from the project site

Our project is in a previously developedPreviously developed sites are those altered by paving, construction, and/or land use that would typically have required regulatory permitting to have been initiated (alterations may exist now or in the past). Previously developed land includes a platted lot on which a building was constructed if the lot is no more than 1 acre; previous development on lots larger than 1 acre is defined as the development footprint and land alterations associated with the footprint. Land that is not previously developed and altered landscapes resulting from current or historical clearing or filling, agricultural or forestry use, or preserved natural area use are considered undeveloped land. The date of previous development permit issuance constitutes the date of previous development, but permit issuance in itself does not constitute previous development." urban site and we do not have an opportunity on the project site to provide the percentage of open space required.

Our project is for a department office building within the local city government.

Would it be possible to attempt an alternative compliance path of having the City designate dedicated open vegetated open space, off-site, that is equal to the requirement, as they have done on previous certifications through the Existing Buildings (EBOMEBOM is an acronym for Existing Buildings: Operations & Maintenance, one of the LEED 2009 rating sytems.) rating system?

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Tristan Roberts Editorial Director – LEEDuser, BuildingGreen, Inc. Oct 29 2010 Moderator

I would say this is worth trying; however, I don't know for sure if it would work.

Anyone have success in a similar situation?

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Nov 03 2010 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Laurie,
This should be a reasonable alternative compliance path for your project. It would be a good idea to provide reasoning to why you could not provide the open space required on site, and details on how the off-site area will be acquired and maintained as open space.

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Devon Bertram Sustainability Manager, YR&G Nov 04 2010 Guest Expert 1370 Thumbs Up

Laurie,
At further thought I would submit a CIRCredit Interpretation Ruling. Used by design team members experiencing difficulties in the application of a LEED prerequisite or credit to a project. Typically, difficulties arise when specific issues are not directly addressed by LEED information/guide for this so you can obtain further guidance and confirmation on whether this approach would comply. As the EB:OM compliance path focuses on SSc5.1 (protect and restore habitat) and not on SSc5.2 (open space), it may not be a sure thing.
Good luck,
Devon

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